BBC News Channel/BBC World News Merger - Printable Version
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RE: BBC News Channel/BBC World News Merger - DTV - 16-12-2022
(16-12-2022, 11:10 PM)cityprod Wrote: Except I ONLY heard this on the World Service bulletins, it WASN'T on the BBC website, I didn't see it or hear it anywhere else. It's not a "single source", it's different products on different stations. Something gets diluted when it gets watered down. Tell me how you are not watering down the whole BBC News brand by requiring it to carry many different products that all need to do different things for different audiences.
What story is this exactly? What possible story is significant enough to get included in the short BBC World Service bulletins but not significant enough to get reported on any other BBC News programme or online?
You are right that something gets diluted when it gets watered down. In branding this is when you start adding too many other brands to your masterbrand and so your masterbrand gets drowned out - such as when people start referring to BBC News on the BBC World Service as simply the 'World Service' or BBC News 24 as 'News 24'. That is brand dilution as the core brand - BBC or BBC News - has been washed out.
BBC News does provide programming for different audiences that does different things. But when it does this, they are marketed as different things (e.g. BBC Newsnight, BBC Politics Live, etc.) to distinguish themselves from the standard BBC News brand which is used for straight news. When they are delivering straight news - regardless of whether it is a TV bulletin, TV rolling news, Radio bulletin, online article or on social media - it's packaged simply as BBC News as that is the product they are delivering - the news from the BBC. It's the same news provided by the same BBC News correspondents just on a different medium.
RE: BBC News Channel/BBC World News Merger - sjhoward - 16-12-2022
(16-12-2022, 10:19 PM)DTV Wrote: Also I really think most people would say 'I heard it on the BBC' - this specific academic-level referencing to specific news bulletins is not a particularly common occurrence.
That’s really interesting because it’s the exact opposite of my experience. It’s not at all uncommon for people to ask me “Did you hear X on the Today programme this morning?” or “Did you see Y on Look North?” - but I don’t think I’ve ever heard someone in natural conversion say “Did you see/hear Z on the BBC yesterday?”
I suppose it just goes to show how varied these things are in real life.
RE: BBC News Channel/BBC World News Merger - Worzel - 17-12-2022
(16-12-2022, 04:38 PM)all new phil Wrote:Because Sky News is primarily known by the general public as a TV News channel.(16-12-2022, 12:18 PM)Worzel Wrote: How they will refer to it on other channels, outlets and online will be interesting to see because BBC News is the overarching brand as well, so its basically the 2008 confusion all over again when the News 24 name was retired.
It’s hardly confusion. People are quite comfortable with Sky News rather than the Sky News channel despite their website, app etc. This literally only seems to be an issue here.
BBC News is a department, brand and also a TV channel in itself.
If a presenter on the BBC News at Six says 'you can catch more of that interview on BBC News' or 'Coverage continues on BBC News' - it's not distinguishing what outlet they mean, it could be on BBC One, online or a TV channel.
My money's on it still being referred to on other outlets as the BBC News channel post-merger.
RE: BBC News Channel/BBC World News Merger - cityprod - 17-12-2022
(16-12-2022, 11:27 PM)DTV Wrote:The story was about how 10,000 police in Afghanistan were beginning literacy training. The whole thing was no more than about 3 or 4 sentences at most, no actuality, nothing. Pure copy story. Went looking it up, found absolutely nothing about it anywhere else, in or outside of BBC News. Was completely baffled why this story had made the bulletins, but wasn't being reported anywhere else.(16-12-2022, 11:10 PM)cityprod Wrote: Except I ONLY heard this on the World Service bulletins, it WASN'T on the BBC website, I didn't see it or hear it anywhere else. It's not a "single source", it's different products on different stations. Something gets diluted when it gets watered down. Tell me how you are not watering down the whole BBC News brand by requiring it to carry many different products that all need to do different things for different audiences.
What story is this exactly? What possible story is significant enough to get included in the short BBC World Service bulletins but not significant enough to get reported on any other BBC News programme or online?
You are right that something gets diluted when it gets watered down. In branding this is when you start adding too many other brands to your masterbrand and so your masterbrand gets drowned out - such as when people start referring to BBC News on the BBC World Service as simply the 'World Service' or BBC News 24 as 'News 24'. That is brand dilution as the core brand - BBC or BBC News - has been washed out.
BBC News does provide programming for different audiences that does different things. But when it does this, they are marketed as different things (e.g. BBC Newsnight, BBC Politics Live, etc.) to distinguish themselves from the standard BBC News brand which is used for straight news. When they are delivering straight news - regardless of whether it is a TV bulletin, TV rolling news, Radio bulletin, online article or on social media - it's packaged simply as BBC News as that is the product they are delivering - the news from the BBC. It's the same news provided by the same BBC News correspondents just on a different medium.
I don't get why you think BBC News is a "masterbrand". BBC is the masterbrand. BBC News is a sub-brand of the BBC. And I don't think it should be required to carry the weight of news broadcasting on Radio 2, Radio 3, Radio 4, Radio 5 Live, Radio 6 Music, BBC Local & Regional Radio, BBC World Service and all the other external services, BBC One, BBC Three, BBC News Channel, BBC World News and all the other external TV services. That's diluting the brand and doing it in such a way as to make the brand seem stretched pretty thin.
This is why you use sub brands, such as BBC World Service News, BBC Radio News, BBC News 24 and so on, to help carry the load, especially where it makes sense because of the vagaries of the product. BBC World Service News is very different to BBC News on local radio, so separating that into its own sub brand makes sense. Same for the news channels. 24 hour rolling news is a very different beast to the roundups on BBC1, so why should the same brand be required to carry those very differing loads? No, use separate channel brands, like BBC News 24, BBC World News, rather than lazily require BBC News to be all things to all audiences at all times, that just doesn't work.
RE: BBC News Channel/BBC World News Merger - DTV - 17-12-2022
(17-12-2022, 12:53 AM)cityprod Wrote: I don't get why you think BBC News is a "masterbrand". BBC is the masterbrand. BBC News is a sub-brand of the BBC. And I don't think it should be required to carry the weight of news broadcasting on Radio 2, Radio 3, Radio 4, Radio 5 Live, Radio 6 Music, BBC Local & Regional Radio, BBC World Service and all the other external services, BBC One, BBC Three, BBC News Channel, BBC World News and all the other external TV services. That's diluting the brand and doing it in such a way as to make the brand seem stretched pretty thin.
This is why you use sub brands, such as BBC World Service News, BBC Radio News, BBC News 24 and so on, to help carry the load, especially where it makes sense because of the vagaries of the product. BBC World Service News is very different to BBC News on local radio, so separating that into its own sub brand makes sense. Same for the news channels. 24 hour rolling news is a very different beast to the roundups on BBC1, so why should the same brand be required to carry those very differing loads? No, use separate channel brands, like BBC News 24, BBC World News, rather than lazily require BBC News to be all things to all audiences at all times, that just doesn't work.
The BBC and BBC News are both masterbrands, clearly; (for the third time now) that's not what brand dilution is; using BBC News as a uniform brand very clearly does work as it has been the approach of BBC News for over a decade - a decade during which engagement with BBC News services increased significantly around the world and it has established itself as one of the key global news brands.
To be quite frank, these are principles that have been core to corporate branding for several decades now. Your idea of branding seems to be based around a similar logic to those who believe that ITV should bring back the regional identities - it seems not to comprehend that more diffused brands are not conducive to building strong multi-media multi-national brands. That's not to say they can't work as individual brands for limited purposes, but that they needlessly parochialise output in an era where you really need as unified a brand as possible (which has benefits aside from just brand recognition, particularly regarding online misinformation).
RE: BBC News Channel/BBC World News Merger - JamesWorldNews - 17-12-2022
“BBC News 24” would solve a multitude of sins........
RE: BBC News Channel/BBC World News Merger - DTV - 17-12-2022
(17-12-2022, 09:08 AM)JamesWorldNews Wrote: “BBC News 24” would solve a multitude of sins........
I suspect there's an element of 'everything should be like when I was in my early-20s' here, but returning to obsolete brands is almost certainly never the answer to a branding issue. Furthermore, all the reasons that News 24 got dropped as a brand still apply - most prominently that is gets frequently shortened to News 24, including by presenters, thus losing the reference to the key BBC and BBC News brands.
LargelyALurker - LargelyALurker - 17-12-2022
(17-12-2022, 12:13 PM)DTV Wrote:(17-12-2022, 09:08 AM)JamesWorldNews Wrote: “BBC News 24” would solve a multitude of sins........
I suspect there's an element of 'everything should be like when I was in my early-20s' here, but returning to obsolete brands is almost certainly never the answer to a branding issue. Furthermore, all the reasons that News 24 got dropped as a brand still apply - most prominently that is gets frequently shortened to News 24, including by presenters, thus losing the reference to the key BBC and BBC News brands.
I don’t know that any reference to News 24 would be confused for a non-BBC channel. Strong sub-brands aren’t necessarily a bad thing - Amazon using the ‘Prime’ brand on its own for one other example.
There’s no perfect answer, but it seems odd to be saying that News 24 isn’t an acceptable sub-brand but Radio 5 Live or iPlayer is. How many people say ‘BBC’ before those, yet we all know they are BBC services.
RE: BBC News Channel/BBC World News Merger - ginnyfan - 17-12-2022
The irony is that it's certainly not going to be BBC News 24 hours a day anymore, with all the radio simulcasts for domestic.
RE: BBC News Channel/BBC World News Merger - Moz - 20-12-2022
(17-12-2022, 12:13 PM)DTV Wrote:(17-12-2022, 09:08 AM)JamesWorldNews Wrote: “BBC News 24” would solve a multitude of sins........
I suspect there's an element of 'everything should be like when I was in my early-20s' here, but returning to obsolete brands is almost certainly never the answer to a branding issue. Furthermore, all the reasons that News 24 got dropped as a brand still apply - most prominently that is gets frequently shortened to News 24, including by presenters, thus losing the reference to the key BBC and BBC News brands.
But that’s not an argument anymore as the they seem to have dropped the compulsory reference to ‘BBC’ - watch on iPlayer, listen on Sounds to mention but two.