Gary Lineker/BBC Asylum Controversy - Printable Version

+- Pres Café (https://pres.cafe)
+-- Forum: Pres Café TV and Radio Forums (https://pres.cafe/forumdisplay.php?fid=1)
+--- Forum: News and Sport Presentation (https://pres.cafe/forumdisplay.php?fid=3)
+--- Thread: Gary Lineker/BBC Asylum Controversy (/showthread.php?tid=381)

---

RE: Gary Lineker/BBC Asylum Controversy - Andrew - 13-03-2023

Breaking News: Gary Lineker is NOT the lead story on the Ten

Must be the first time since Wednesday

---

RE: Gary Lineker/BBC Asylum Controversy - leewilliams - 13-03-2023

(13-03-2023, 02:06 PM)leewilliams Wrote:  All eyes on tomorrow’s Daily Mail front page which I imagine will be all kinds of livid because there’s been:

- No apology from Lineker
- No punishment for Lineker
- Another pro-refugee tweet from Lineker

Do the BBC ignore the right-wing media critique this time that got them into this mess in the first place?

Well strike me down with a feather:

https://twitter.com/hendopolis/status/1635403410525638661?s=46&t=OuG-53CJRHzzDVEPmDXGSg 

---

RE: Gary Lineker/BBC Asylum Controversy - W. Knight - 14-03-2023

All this might have been avoided, had they got a better guidelines three years ago...

Quote:Richard Sambrook, a former BBC News executive and emeritus professor of journalism at Cardiff University, was engaged in 2020 to help draw up new social media rules for BBC journalists.

Sources said Sambrook delivered around a dozen recommendations to Davie and senior managers, one of which was to carry out a separate examination of guidance for freelance presenters outside of news.

There is concern that his advice was not fully acted upon because it could have created complications with presenter contracts in a fiercely competitive market for on-screen talent.

Sambrook’s report was never published by the BBC, meaning there is no public record of his findings and recommendations, other than the social media rules introduced following his work.

(Deadline)

---

RE: Gary Lineker/BBC Asylum Controversy - bananaman - 14-03-2023

Surely part of the problem relating to sports presenters and impartiality comes from how there seems to be a growing crossover between BBC news and sports coverage - I'm thinking of the likes of Ros Atkins appearing before the World Cup opening game, Dan Roan appearing on the World Cup draw coverage or BBC Rome correspondent Mark Lowen appearing on the Euro 2020 preview show.

Obviously this has gone the other way as well for much longer with people like Jonathan Agnew or John Murray appearing on (mostly the radio) news as Cricket/football correspondent, TV sports news bulletins being clearly branded as BBC Sport and so on.
And that's not even mentioning Dan Walker who walked the line between the two.

With sport being so politicised generally, as seen with the bans on Russian players, the human rights criticism of Qatar and the wrangling over sportspeople taking the knee it would seem reasonable to have the same level of impartiality for TV sports presenters as news presenters. Obviously this past weekend has shown the BBC don't have any idea how to implement it.

---

RE: Gary Lineker/BBC Asylum Controversy - Adsales - 14-03-2023

(14-03-2023, 12:40 AM)bananaman Wrote:  Surely part of the problem relating to sports presenters and impartiality comes from how there seems to be a growing crossover between BBC news and sports coverage - I'm thinking of the likes of Ros Atkins appearing before the World Cup opening game, Dan Roan appearing on the World Cup draw coverage or BBC Rome correspondent Mark Lowen appearing on the Euro 2020 preview show.

Obviously this has gone the other way as well for much longer with people like Jonathan Agnew or John Murray appearing on (mostly the radio) news as Cricket/football correspondent, TV sports news bulletins being clearly branded as BBC Sport and so on.
And that's not even mentioning Dan Walker who walked the line between the two.

With sport being so politicised generally, as seen with the bans on Russian players, the human rights criticism of Qatar and the wrangling over sportspeople taking the knee it would seem reasonable to have the same level of impartiality for TV sports presenters as news presenters. Obviously this past weekend has shown the BBC don't have any idea how to implement it.

Until the BBC either employs people like GL (although doubtful he or any of the others in his position would ever want to be employed as this would result in restrictions on their other business activities) or the government changes IR-35 legislation, there is legally nothing that can be implemented. 

The second the BBC pushes through rules which apply to freelancers during times where they are not actually on air (e.g. their personal social media) and freelancers accept those rules, HMRC will, rightly under current legislation, consider all of them inside IR-35 which in turn means they have to pay PAYE tax, NI contributions and the BBC will also have to pay employer NICs.

Make matters worse, those freelancers would then also be entitled, should they wish, to the BBC's employee benefits.

This would result in higher expenses for the BBC at a time where it's strapped for cash and it would likely also result in many of the current faces disappearing from the BBC as they would otherwise have to give up they other gigs.

So in reality, the only option is for the BBC to make clear that impartiality does not imply outside of being on air, possibly with the exception of those working in news and current affairs.

Personally, I just don't get what the problem is. Public broadcasters in other countries manage just fine. As long as a presenter leaves their personal opinions at the door and is completely impartial whilst on air there should not be a problem. It's not uncommon in other European countries for presenters' voting intention to be known but on air they are impartial and professional.

---

RE: Gary Lineker/BBC Asylum Controversy - Steve in Pudsey - 14-03-2023

Is it possible to make that exception for a news freelancer without them coming under IR-35? I assume you're taking about freelancers with a regular gig at the BBC rather than somebody picking up the odd shift here and there

---

RE: Gary Lineker/BBC Asylum Controversy - Adsales - 14-03-2023

(14-03-2023, 09:07 AM)Steve in Pudsey Wrote:  Is it possible to make that exception for a news freelancer without them coming under IR-35? I assume you're taking about freelancers with a regular gig at the BBC rather than somebody picking up the odd shift here and there

Not without a change of the law. The exception would have to be legislated for but that of course would open a can of worms. Why would the BBC be treated differently? It's all about control of the client over the freelancer which has to be pretty much absent to stay outside IR-35.

An employee has to follow reasonable instructions given by the employer and that can include outside working hours social media use for example. A freelancer has to produce deliverables for which they invoice. It doesn't matter how they are delivered as long as they are. Even something as small as a combination of the freelancer using equipment provided by the client plus a company e-mail address plus being given a business card can be enough to push them inside IR-35. There have been cases where freelancers being included in an all-company Christmas party invite e-mail was sufficient!

You can have a play with the HMRC status checker 
https://www.tax.service.gov.uk/check-employment-status-for-tax/what-do-you-want-to-find-out 

Personally I think anyone who appears on the news or current affairs shows should be employed and be barred from any work which could be seen as not being impartial. Be that Fiona Bruce writing for the Express, Cathy Newman being the voice of the left on Times Radio or Rees-Mogg (and others) continuing to be sitting MPs while presenting shows on GBN.

---

RE: Gary Lineker/BBC Asylum Controversy - Brekkie - 14-03-2023

I think the real problem here is that the bill was debated and voted on in Parliament last night - and this morning there is no sign of that being reported on on the BBC News homepage, and indeed the Sky News homepage too. ITV News has an article way down the page - but largely it's got through Parliament with virtually no media scrutiny, and it's not the first time that has happened with bills which really should warrant more scrutiny.

---

RE: Gary Lineker/BBC Asylum Controversy - Steve in Pudsey - 14-03-2023

On the other hand it's only a second reading, and largely a formality given that the government has a sufficiently large majority to barge through anything it wants to.

---

RE: Gary Lineker/BBC Asylum Controversy - Stockland Hillman - 14-03-2023

(14-03-2023, 09:25 AM)Adsales Wrote:  

(14-03-2023, 09:07 AM)Steve in Pudsey Wrote:  Is it possible to make that exception for a news freelancer without them coming under IR-35? I assume you're taking about freelancers with a regular gig at the BBC rather than somebody picking up the odd shift here and there

Not without a change of the law. The exception would have to be legislated for but that of course would open a can of worms. Why would the BBC be treated differently? It's all about control of the client over the freelancer which has to be pretty much absent to stay outside IR-35.

An employee has to follow reasonable instructions given by the employer and that can include outside working hours social media use for example. A freelancer has to produce deliverables for which they invoice. It doesn't matter how they are delivered as long as they are. Even something as small as a combination of the freelancer using equipment provided by the client plus a company e-mail address plus being given a business card can be enough to push them inside IR-35. There have been cases where freelancers being included in an all-company Christmas party invite e-mail was sufficient!

You can have a play with the HMRC status checker 
https://www.tax.service.gov.uk/check-employment-status-for-tax/what-do-you-want-to-find-out 

Personally I think anyone who appears on the news or current affairs shows should be employed and be barred from any work which could be seen as not being impartial. Be that Fiona Bruce writing for the Express, Cathy Newman being the voice of the left on Times Radio or Rees-Mogg (and others) continuing to be sitting MPs while presenting shows on GBN.

Adsales and I respectively disagree on this point, while what he says is true of run of the mill outsourced workers and contractors, it isn't  true in all situations.

Only a judge can determine the enforceability of a contract clause, but a well drafted agreement can deal with the reputational protection requirement requiring similar/same behaviour as wider workers in an organisation. IR35 issues are a separate argument (one even judges have differed)

I can tell you categorically that onair/performing talent do have enforceable restrictions at higher ££ levels (negotiated rather than default contract) they are enforceable because agreeing to said terms gives  a defined financial reward. 

For example, how do you think actors who do something reputationally 'bad' get terminated and removed from role mid contract?  I've personally seen examples on both sides.

---