[James2001]

I remember what we watched- Story World with Tony Robinson, the first ever schools programme I watched

Was what I knew Tony for best, years before I'd heard of Blackadder!

[James2001]

There's another interval here from 1990- yet again there doesn't seem to be any sign of a non-sync frame roll.

www.youtube.com 

Yet again the supporting materials caption looks like a slide or physical caption- there's even loads of dust all over it. Does seem a bit odd these were still in use so late, can't find too many examples of physical slides and captions still being used for this sort of thing after around 1988-ish.

[Clean Feed]

Further to the discussion earlier in this thread, where there was the suggestion that TV-am may have been involved in the playout of ads during The Channel 4 Daily...

...a source has provided the following info to Clean Feed:

- TV-am was responsible for selling ad airtime for The Channel 4 Daily.

- The ads during The Channel 4 Daily were inserted by ITN.  The programme and ads went via Channel 4 Presentation.

- No rerouting took place at 9.25am.

- The reason for the schools interval being split in two was to allow for the old demarcation at 9.28am - all the stuff agreed with the IBA when schools moved over to Channel 4. The interval was played by Channel 4 Presentation.

[Steve in Pudsey]

Interesting about ITN playing the ads. To muddy the waters, the first episode of the Big Breakfast (September 92, so under the same arrangement with TV-am) has cue dots into the breaks so I assume C4 pres were playing them out?

I can't immediately find a clip of the C4 Daily going to a break to check if there were cute dots but I imagine they wouldn't have been necessary

[Clean Feed]

Interesting about ITN playing the ads. To muddy the waters, the first episode of the Big Breakfast (September 92, so under the same arrangement with TV-am) has cue dots into the breaks so I assume C4 pres were playing them out?

I can't immediately find a clip of the C4 Daily going to a break to check if there were cute dots but I imagine they wouldn't have been necessary

Not sure I'd read too much into the presence of cue dots. The programme gallery wouldn't have been responsible for the ads and undoubtedly, would have been somewhat chaotic whilst the programme was on air.  Firing up a cue dot would've been a fairly standard means of communicating with a separate group, responsible for playing out the ads - even if they were based in the same building.

One other interesting nugget - we were also led to believe there was a possibility that Channel 4 was playing out some ads post-midnight during the C4D era and these would've been on the feed coming out of Charlotte Street and passed to the ITV companies.

[robertclark125]

Further to the discussion earlier in this thread, where there was the suggestion that TV-am may have been involved in the playout of ads during The Channel 4 Daily...

...a source has provided the following info to Clean Feed:

- TV-am was responsible for selling ad airtime for The Channel 4 Daily.

- The ads during The Channel 4 Daily were inserted by ITN.  The programme and ads went via Channel 4 Presentation.

- No rerouting took place at 9.25am.

- The reason for the schools interval being split in two was to allow for the old demarcation at 9.28am - all the stuff agreed with the IBA when schools moved over to Channel 4. The interval was played by Channel 4 Presentation.

Given ITN were co-ordinating the whole show, playing out the consumer slot, I guess they just played out the adverts like playing out reports.

Interesting that about the interval. From the examples shown, I imagine the trailer run at 09:25 would be the equivalent of the first continuity announcement of the day, when schools were on ITV, the announcer saying good morning etc, and telling you what else was on today, before putting up the slide, with the run down of schools programmes. The interval would be the equivalent on the slide.

[sparky_75]

There's another interval here from 1990- yet again there doesn't seem to be any sign of a non-sync frame roll.

www.youtube.com 

Yet again the supporting materials caption looks like a slide or physical caption- there's even loads of dust all over it. Does seem a bit odd these were still in use so late, can't find too many examples of physical slides and captions still being used for this sort of thing after around 1988-ish.

Have a bit of first hand knowledge of this...
The C4 "Roto" was entirely computer generated - designed by Central TVs in house promotions team.

The "supporting items" image is likely to be a transfer of a 35mm slide. Many of these were still in use fro years - but had been transferred to Tape as individual slide scans - some with all the dust/faded images and crap on them.
Invariably, the slides would be produced by the programme maker.
With ATV / Central responsible for networking Schools Programmes from Birmingham - chances are they just sat on the slides as they were'nt specific to content of the programme, but only specific to the series. (Saves making up more slides)

Many of the programmes shown - even after the move to Channel 4 were made on 16mm film; in the case of Central programmes - some were slightly re-edited each term (esp in the case of Stop, Look Listen and Good Health) with new prints struck for transmission.
The Film Unit at Central closed in 1990 - and most of their schools programmes ended up being made on Tape thereafter.

Incidentally, both versions of the Schools Clock used on ITV were mechanical, and aired using a caption scanner camera.
The programme caption would be replaced between programmes, the captions being white text on black background.
There were also 35mm versions of this too - without the captions - which could be used by regions who had opted out of Network programming to show their own (Westward / HTV Wales etc) - programmes with the film clocks attached are easy to spot, as the clock judders and jumps as it counts dow!
By 1985 - the clock was sourced from a Videotape transfer.

[sparky_75]

I don't know the answer but I imagine given there would have been a full minute from the end of the previous programme, and the next programme was for schools, perhaps there simply wasn't thought to be much demand for an isolated morning break?

Did any ITV companies open up with a break after TV-am? I'm racking my brains but every cap I can remember seeing goes straight from the eggcup card to a trail or an ident.

In the early days, ITV company went from the end of TV-AM to the company start up.
In the midlands, if my memory serves me - TV-AM would end, then a quick trail/final ad break and then the Central Startup would begin.

[sparky_75]

Any TV-am involvement in Channel 4 breakfast transmission is a new one on me.  Is that documented somewhere (other than in the comments on that YT clip)?

In the same way that the regional ITV companies sold the C4 adverts for their patch, and the C4 feed went via the regions who inserted those ads, the assumption is that TV-am did the same.

They certainly sold the ads:

twitter.com 

Under the 1980 Franchise requirements, ITV companies had to make provision for Channel 4 opt-outs in their area.
I can't speak for the other regions - but at Central; there was additional equipment to cater for showing local programmes and advertising on Channel 4 in the Midlands area.
Not sure if any programmes were every broadcast regionally on C4 - but some advertising was local.

[Neil Jones]

The C4 "Roto" was entirely computer generated - designed by Central TVs in house promotions team

Not a surprise it was computer generated, it was very similar to Central's style at the time.
Were they able to animate that to completion in house (similar to the idents) as I'm sure I read somewhere (it may not have been ITV Schools on 4 related) that this sort of work computers didn't have processing power and it had to be done in the States?

Of course if you know what you're doing these days you can knock that up to completion in an hour or so, as demonstrated here:
tvforum.uk  (although it quickly became the Ballyboy show ) - but in the 80s...

Ballyboy Asks a Question: Fromerly After Effects Help - TV Forum
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